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I can see that, just like me, many people here…

5 years ago • June 20, 2021 • by ourCOG

I can see that, just like me, many people here also disagrees with Calvinism, but it’s a bit too much if we label Calvinists as heretics, they are not. Their theology is one of the possible biblical explanation of God’s sovereignty/providence. The only possible reasons why we disagree with Calvinism is either, we don’t like it, or, we don’t fully understand it. As for me, I can say that I fully understand it but I just don’t like it. All Christians has the freedom to assume a non-Calvinist position and that’s okay, no Calvinists who are truly Christians should call you a heretic for that so long as we’re staying within the boundaries of orthodox Christianity

So having said that, please be respectful with our responses to our Calvinist brothers here and I also expect the same thing from Calvinists

Categories: #ourCOG

Discussion

24 comments

  1. Richard Byron Mator says:
    April 13, 2020 at 10:36 am

    I’ve studied many Faith’s and have studied under Dr. James White and Dr. Burnett. I think Calvin’s are close. I am still having trouble with predestination but indeed they are very Christian..

    Reply
  2. Justin Bennett says:
    April 13, 2020 at 10:52 am

    As one who is drawn more to the scholarly and intellectual side of the faith, I greatly appreciate all that the reformed community has contributed over the years.

    Reply
  3. Greg Barolet says:
    April 13, 2020 at 11:45 am

    The church has been reformed. Augustinian, Calvinistic since Christ. Anyone disagreeing was labeled a heretic. Jacob Arminius, semi-pelagians, and pelagius..

    Reply
  4. Isaiah Hess says:
    April 13, 2020 at 12:18 pm

    Some non-Calvinist positions are heresy, some are not.

    Arminianism? Not heresy.
    Molinism? Not heresy.
    Open Theism? Flagrant heresy.
    Pelagianism? Flagrant heresy.

    Reply
  5. James A. Henson says:
    April 13, 2020 at 1:43 pm

    Some people speak of “free will,” the human will is a servant of the heart… it carries out the desires of the heart…it’s just that the desire of the unregenerate heart is not for God!

    Reply
  6. C Cornell Hicks says:
    April 13, 2020 at 2:20 pm

    I do not agree with Calvinism, but the Calvinist is still my brother or sister in Christ. As Christians who disagree with Calvinism, we need not resort to calling Calvinists heretics. However, Calvinists also need to be equally as careful not to label us as heretics as well.

    I have spoken with many Calvinists who almost immediately play the heretic card, the MINUTE we disagree with Calvinism.

    If y’all like Calvin, cool, but please remember, he didn’t come along until over 1500 years after the 1st century where Biblical doctrine had already been established…

    Reply
  7. Rob Kuder says:
    April 13, 2020 at 2:21 pm

    Thank you for this. I am a Calvinist but I feel the same way about Arminians. There are some doctrines that I would consider heresy (papal infallibility, universalism) and disassociate from those that believe in them. There are doctrines that if someone rejected (substitutionary atonement) then I would disassociate with them. I do not consider the differences between Arminians and Calvinists to be so drastic. Unfortunately some people make every little thing divisive.

    There is a lot that I could learn from Arminian theologians and I have a lot of respect for the hard work of Arminian leaders.

    The question is; are we born again and does our salvation bring forth fruit?

    Reply
  8. Kirralee Clough says:
    April 13, 2020 at 3:07 pm

    if it fits the literal definition of heresy i see no problems in calling it heresy

    Reply
  9. Anthony Jimison says:
    April 13, 2020 at 4:35 pm

    Thank you. At the end of the day we are all studying God and trying to understand how God works. We are all brothers and sisters whether you believe in election or free will.

    Reply
  10. Celeste Marie says:
    April 13, 2020 at 5:10 pm

    We should follow Jesus, not Peter, not Luther, not Calvin. The moment we begin to argue over the teachings of men, our pride is in play and we have taken our eyes off God.

    Reply
  11. Royal Angela says:
    April 13, 2020 at 5:23 pm

    What is a Calvinist?

    Reply
  12. Jef Son says:
    April 13, 2020 at 5:51 pm

    I have no problem with Calvinism. But I have a problem with Open Theism.

    Reply
  13. Celeste Marie says:
    April 13, 2020 at 6:33 pm

    Scripture says God has chosen AND that we must choose.
    Scripture says righteousness is imputed to us AND that we must be sanctified.
    Scripture says we are saved by faith AND that faith without works is dead.

    The fact that we cannot reconcile that which appears to be contradictory in Scripture is a testament to only one fact: we are NOT GOD.

    We are to earnestly study and seek to understand, but God alone reveals. Lacking understanding or disagreeing with someone else’s understanding of Scripture, does not give us permission to attack a brother/sister or to throw around accusations of demonic activity and heresy.

    Many things are hard to grasp. Speaking the truth in LOVE is not one of them.

    Isaiah 55:8“For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways,” declares the Lord.

    Reply
  14. Grant Reedy says:
    April 13, 2020 at 6:44 pm

    So why are you blocking those who disagree with Calvinism especially when the Calvinism defence is Roman 9 which is directed at the Jews refusal of Christ and the Holy Spirit?

    Calvinism and Arminian are both correct and both incorrect.

    Take the garbage out of both of them and one would be closer to the Truth.

    Reply
  15. John Moses says:
    April 13, 2020 at 6:57 pm

    Correct, it’s wrong to accuse others. We are all brothers and sisters

    Reply
  16. Herb Van Schoick says:
    April 13, 2020 at 7:06 pm

    Thank you brother!

    Reply
  17. Eric Dupree says:
    April 13, 2020 at 7:18 pm

    What is most disturbing about the conversation ongoing most of the day is…

    I personally, NOT ONE TIME, used the term ‘Calvinism’ until the term was implied to me when all I was asking was someone if they believed the Bible.

    I’ve been called a liar, heretic, unbeliever, instrument of Satan, and attacked multiple times for……

    POSTING SCRIPTURE…..
    Romans 9- which some even flat out said was satanic, and not in the Bible.

    I understand it is a hard section of Scripture to assimilate, but it IS SCRIPTURE nevertheless, and EVERYONE in the conversation today has to grapple with not only Romans 9, but MANY other references in SCRIPTURE about God’s sovereignty in salvation. It is unpalatable, a hard truth….one I dont claim to fully grasp, just as I don’t grasp why God allows the brokenness of this world to continue, and the horror of many things that happen. I still struggle with this, BUT HE IS GOD, AND I AM NOT. I have looked at both sides for over 30 years and either I simply deny what is found throughout Scripture- both OT & NT or I acknowledge that the truth ‘Scripture Interprets Scripture’ …it is simply undeniable….and believe me- I’ve looked for a loophole many, many times.

    So call me what you will, attack all you want, name names and such…but I cannot deny a truth that permeates all of Scripture- GOD SAVES WHOM HE CHOOSES TO SAVE, and we CANNOT THWART HIS HAND.

    I lost my oldest firstborn daughter almost 3 years ago….she was in the hospital 503 days fighting for her life from chronic disease. Do you think I havent questioned His goodness, and purpose, and sovereignty???!!!

    It’s easy to step back and pass judgment and criticize because something is not easy to stomach….try losing your 27 year old daughter who struggled with chronic disease since she was 11, had two complete knee replacements by the time she was 16 and turned 26, and 27 in the hospital…both of which she was never even aware of.

    Do you think its easy to live with these truths? I do because I’m not parroting ‘refutes’ or ‘regurgitating theological arguments’ to win debates.

    I, like many others have had to exist in light of this hard truth….but I cannot do anything other.

    Reply
  18. Kim Fanning says:
    April 13, 2020 at 8:19 pm

    Agreed!

    Reply
  19. Gary Stapp says:
    April 13, 2020 at 8:23 pm

    I don’t believe in the Calvinist way of thinking but I don’t consider them heretical.

    Reply
  20. Yehoshua Marion says:
    April 13, 2020 at 8:30 pm

    So there’s parts of Calvinism that I understand and agree with and there’s parts I don’t I think the big problem is this limited atonement thing. The Bible makes it clear that Jesus took on the sins of the whole world not part of the world not a few guys but everybody.
    However I do know that some are chosen and many are called in fact Jesus said it himself that few are chosen and many are called.
    Mostly I see a mixture of armenism and Calvinism I see points on both sides that make good arguments but I think neither side has an entirely right.

    Reply
  21. Gary Stapp says:
    April 13, 2020 at 8:50 pm

    Romans 9 is the Calvinist chapter in the bible. God does do what he wants and calls who he wants but the calling to be saved and the calling to good work is not the same. The Calvinist like to use Pharaoh as an example. If you read in Exodus Pharaohs heart was hardened 6 times before God hardened Pharaohs heart. 3 of the times Pharaoh hardened his own heart while God was showing his power. 3 times it says Pharaohs heart was hardened. After that God hardened Pharaohs heart. Yes God is sovereign, but man has a free will and when God was doing all those signs Pharaoh had a chance to believe in faith but he hardened his heart. He chose not to believe.

    Reply
  22. Liz Browne says:
    April 14, 2020 at 4:22 am

    It’s not about liking it or disliking it and I understand it very well. The reason I don’t agree with Calvinism is because it’s not Biblical. Not one bit.

    Reply
  23. Jeremy Notchick says:
    April 14, 2020 at 6:31 am

    I’m a Calvinist, and from what you wrote, I want to say sorry for the calvinists you have encountered that didn’t treat you with grace or love. I honestly think Calvinists get a bad rap from hyper-calvinists. I think we can learn a great deal from the relationship between Wesley and Whitfield. Two great men of the faith on totally different ends of the spectrum in this debate, but had a love and admiration for each other. I wish we could all be more like that. I don’t look at anyone as a heretic unless they are preaching a contrary Gospel.

    Reply
  24. I can see that, just like me, many people here… #ourCOG – ourcog says:
    June 20, 2021 at 8:00 am

    […] I can see that, just like me, many people here… […]

    Reply

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