All #ourCOG News 5.0
neither Calvinist nor Arminian ,but am christian.
is it sound?
Discussion
81 comments
-
It’s like saying “I’m neither an American nor Russian, but a human being.” It could be distinguished but not necessarily contradicting. We can be both a human being and an American at the same time.
-
of course, neither can be proven
-
SAVED SINNER
-
BIBLE BELIEVING
-
Those are actually mere distinctions of the kinds of beliefs people have about Christianity. As long as you abide by the biblical and Spirit-approved doctrines you are good. Don’t let anyone indoctrinate you with false principles like the so-called prosperity gospel and other heretic dogma. Stick to following Christ, no more, no less.
-
thats fine, calvinism and the armini thing are all nonsense
-
I am a citizen of Heaven.
-
calvinists and arminians are also Christians..
-
There are only two adhering doctrine of Christian faith, salvation is of God alone or salvation is of God and man. One is right and the other one is almost right. ????????????????? You Choose. ???????? They can’t be both right.. ??????
-
yes
-
Yes , don’t adopt anything but the word
-
Yes
-
If you’re a Calvinist, a true one, it means you are born again, and also means you’re a true Christian!
If you’re an Arminian (not Armenian, as the place has nothing to do with it), it means you were born only once, and you must be born again!Any professing Christian cannot be but one or the other! No neutral ground! You are either born again, or you’re not!
-
I am neither, but there is overlap, more than many would like to admit. If you put your faith in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior and believe that He died on the cross and resurrected, you have believed the Gospel and are born again.
-
The Bible is non denominational.
-
It’s sound but your beliefs probably line up with atleast one.
-
Not sound…
-
Yes
-
James 1:8 KJV
A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.James 4:8 KJV
Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded. -
Yes!
Sometimes this belonging to sounds ‘cultic .
What about to just belong to Christianity and agree with what is right and no to what’s wrong but just be a Christian. -
Kinda
-
Salvation is about who you know. And having the Holy Spirit.
-
Either you are a Synergist or Monergist you cannot be both.
Jesus taught Monergism -
I’m a Jesusism
-
Yes
-
BIBLICIST ❤️
-
Does undecided or misunderstanding (depending on your viewpoint) count?
-
Why not. As a Calvinist, I know not all Christians are Calvinists. We will still be together in Heaven.
-
Truth is halfway between Arminian and Calvinism. I’m 2.5 calvinist, half Calvinism is just the right balance.
Total depravity is correct, but lacks the balance of being made in the image of God and understanding that people do seek God in their own way.Election is technically conditional, but unconditional election isn’t far from true, as God knows what we’ll decide, to accept or reject before he makes us.
Limited atonement and irresistible Grace are completely false.
Perseverance of the Saints is very biblical.
-
My brother, a Calvinist, and I have this debate all the time. I was really considering placing my trust into more of the Calvinistic worldview as I could not find very many sound arguments against it….then I discovered the video from Mike Winger on his biblical refutation of Calvinism….I’m now comfortably caught in between, subscribing to the T.U.I.P. without the L…if that makes sense?!!?????♂️. I still kind of view it as something we’ll know for sure when we’ve moved on toward glorification. The important thing is that I am His and have a lifetime of continued sanctification to walk it out with Him! ?
-
It’s sound
-
I’m more of a Spurgeonist or a washer which is right in the middle.
-
Both groups will see salvation, nothing is a salvation issue, its the hyper calvanists and the hyper arminians were I see salvation issues.
-
Sure, there are more than just Calvinists and Arminians.
-
Whether Catholic, Baptist, Pentecostal, Methodist, Lutheran etc is useless and meaningless. The focus and goal is Christ Jesus until we become one.
Ephesians 4:11-14
[11]And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
[12]For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
[13]Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
[14]That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; -
Yes we’re supposed to be followers of Christ. Study your Bible get to know it and then you’ll know the true Doctrine. Don’t listen to men until you’ve attained a good grasp of what it says. Calvinism and Armenianism are both partly correct.
-
It’s fine.
-
I think there will be a lot of calvinist and arminians who will be surprised to see each other in Heaven.
-
Honestly, even though I’ve read countless, lonnnng article’s on the two, I don’t totally understand either and and doubt it makes much difference
-
At first I was Arminian because it was what I was taught as a young convert. But as I began to study and search scriptures, I started to notice a pattern that led to my changing positions as I began to read the writings of Augustin, Luther, Spurgeon, Calvin, it solidified my position in predestination (it’s what you refer to as CALVISM)
-
Only thang we can be is a Christian these labels are man made
-
Nope.
-
What were they before Calvin or Arminian?
-
I have always been a Christian. Then one day someone told me that i follow Calvinists principles. I didn’t know a thing about Calvin! So apparently i am a Calvinist and didn’t know it. lol
-
Absolutely! Don’t deviate to doctrines of men. Do not veer to the left or to the right but stick solely with God’s Word, and not the blind words of men.
-
Christianity supersedes religion or politics
-
Of course.
-
Respectfully, are you new to your faith in Christ.
-
All come under Religion. The kingdom of God is not a religion.
-
Christianity means havoc
-
Yes
-
A person who agrees with me.
-
I stand for Pre destination and election not because of Calvin but i read it in the scriptures
-
The early believers are called Christian only no less no more
And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.Acts 11:26
-
I don’t know enough about Calvinism and Arminianism to address that specifically, but I do know it’s virtually impossible to be a mere Christian. There are important questions that must be tackled by any sincere believer, and how we answer will divide us into branches and denominations.
-
Biblicist
-
The important is to brought us to Salvation of Jesus Christ..
-
So long as you’re not a Bidenian or a Pelosian. LOL
-
I agree. I am the same. I didnt even know about these categories until after I was brought out of the darkness of religion. I used to consider myself a Baptist I guess. But now I only claim to be a follower of the Way
-
James 1:8 KJV
A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.James 4:8 KJV
Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded. -
Make sure your a Christian if you dont know what is free will and pre destination youe being a christian is Questionable . You are not reading your bible
-
Articulating your beliefs through the writings of others can be a good thing. We can learn to dig in deeper by studying the thoughts of great thinkers. That doesn’t mean you should blindly follow a particular teaching or latch on to everything that comes down that pipe-line as gospel truth. Instead, we should study the Scriptures daily to see if those things are so (Acts 17:11).
I can be rightly called a Calvinist though I don’t necessarily hold to everything John Calvin taught. I can be called that based on my doctrinal position lines up with what he taught about God’s Sovereignty and grace.
-
Yes, I myself am neither Calvinist nor Arminian. I find they are both right on some points, but wrong in others.
-
If you are reading your Bible you should be growing and asking questions of God. Studying the great theologians that have gone before us and always going back to God’s word as you study the Spirit will open your eyes and heart. You should know that Arminian was a works based, man centered belief. Making God impotent in salvation.
-
Me too
-
Wherein in the Holy Scriptures does God or Jesus ever speak of such things, but as “religious orders” or “sects” …. which are divisions/schisms …. caused by one or more teachings, heresy or otherwise?
-
Take the garbage out of both and join them together and you would be closer to the Truth or one could just submit and commit to the Holy Spirit as Christ promised those who believe in Him, being the Word of God from Genesis to Revelation??♂️.
-
Much as I dislike labels, our view of salvation fits one of two possibilities:
Calvinist: God is sovereign in salvation
Arminian: Man is sovereign in salvationEveryone is one or the other
-
Prefer Jesus-believer, trusting reverently in the Holy Blood of the Lamb for salvation alone, being led-guided by the Holy Word of God Incarnate, Jesus the Christ. Amen and Amen.
-
very
-
choose one of it bra
-
no because Synergism is not Compatible with Monergism .They are contradictory
Jesus taught monergism man teaches Synergism. -
I like the saying “Calvinism and arminianism meet in a river called Grace” because complete predestination makes God the author of sin he’s choosing who sitting in who’s coming to know him and in complete free will it makes God inferior to men’s free will but the middle is a river of grace.
-
Hopefully this will help. From the late Jack Kinsella. I have to post it in two parts
The Omega Letter Intelligence Digest
The Predestination Controversy
Vol: 97 Issue: 3 Saturday, October 3, 2009One of the most controversial points of doctrine (after the Rapture) among believers is the doctrine of ‘predestination’.
‘Predestination’ is generally misunderstood as the belief that God chose you to be saved before the world began. And that there are others who He does NOT choose.
As the Bible presents it, ‘predestination’ is simply Divine foreknowledge.
“For whom He did foreknow, He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He did predestinate, them He also called: and whom He called, them He also justified: and whom He justified, them He also glorified.” (Romans 8:29)
Predestination is a central point in Calvinism, which helps to explain why it is so controversial. Most Christians shun the label ‘Calvinist’ altogether, not sure if they are ‘hyper-Calvinists’, modified Calvinists’, or indeed, it they are Calvinist at all.
The main argument against predestination is that it mitigates free will. If one is predestined to be saved, then God made the choice for you so where is the free will? Foreknowledge is not predestination anymore that Bible prophecy is.
In both instances, God knows the future, but the choices that bring about that future are made by man. Their free will is unaffected. God knows the future — they don’t.
Within Christianity, there are two basic schools of thought on issues of salvation, grace and faith — Calvinism and Arminianism. There really isn’t a third — any other position is a modification of one of these two.
For the most part, mainstream Protestants and Pentecostals embrace Arminianism, which conforms to the Catholic positions adopted at the Council of Trent.
The Arminian school of thought rejects Dispensationalism, pretribulationalism, and the doctrine of eternal security and embraces Replacement Theology.
The term ‘Arminianism’ comes from Jacobus Arminius who was a Divinity Professor at Leiden University in Holland early in the seventeenth century.
The Five Points of Arminianism:
1. God has decreed to save through Jesus Christ those of the fallen and sinful race who through the grace of the Holy Spirit believe in Him, but leaves in sin the incorrigible and unbelieving.
2. Christ died for all men (not just for the elect), but no one except the believer has remission of sin.
3. Man can neither of himself nor of his free will do anything truly good until he is born again of God, in Christ, through the Holy Spirit.
4. All good deeds or movements in the regenerate must be ascribed to the grace of God but His grace is not irresistible.
5. Those who are incorporated into Christ by a true faith have power given them through the assisting grace of the Holy Spirit to persevere in the faith. But it IS possible for a believer to fall from grace and lose his salvation.
According to Arminianism, then, salvation is accomplished through the combined efforts of God and man. One is saved by grace through works, and one’s salvation is maintained by not sinning — at least not habitually.
Sort of like maintaining a balance between good works and bad works.
The Five Points of Calvinism:
1. Total depravity of man: Man is unable to believe the Gospel apart from the Holy Spirit and cannot respond on his own. Consequently, it takes much more than the Spirit’s assistance to bring a sinner to Christ – it takes regeneration by which the Spirit makes the sinner alive and gives him a new nature.
2. Unconditional election: God’s choice of certain individuals unto salvation before the foundation of the world rested solely in His own sovereign will.
3. Limited atonement: Jesus didn’t die for ALL men, just for those who were predestinated to receive Him. (Points #2 and #3 are the ones that give rise to the most objections. Even from those who believe that the Jews were similarly chosen exclusively through the sovereign election of God)
4. Irresistible Grace: The internal call (which is made only to the elect) cannot be rejected; it always results in conversion.
5. Perseverance of the saints: (Eternal Security) All who are chosen by God, redeemed by Christ, and given faith by the Spirit are eternally saved. They are kept in faith by the power of Almighty God and thus persevere to the end.
Calvinism teaches that salvation is entirely the work of God; God chose His elect, the Son died to pay their sin debt, and the Holy Spirit makes Christ’s death effective by bringing the elect to faith and repentance, thereby causing them to willingly obey the Gospel.
The entire process (election, redemption, regeneration) is the work of God and is by grace alone. In this view, it is God, and not man, that determines who will be saved and who will be lost.
Both suffer from the same fundamental flaw in thinking — that foreknowledge is the same as predestination. Simple logic tells you that because you don’t know your own future, your free will decisions are unaffected by the fact that God does.
-
Part Two:
Assessment:
And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the CALLED according to His purpose. (Romans 8:28)
The goodness of God in converting and saving sinners encourages others to hope in His grace and mercy. Our faith, our conversion, and our eternal salvation, are not of works, lest any man should boast. These things are not brought to pass by any thing done by us, therefore all boasting is shut out.
“Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;” (Titus 3:5)
It is the free gift of God, and the effect of being quickened by His power. It was His purpose, to which he prepared us, by blessing us with the knowledge of His will, and His Holy Spirit producing such a change in us, that we should glorify God by our perseverance to holiness.
Holiness (Gk hagiasmos) means purification which is a PROCESS, also accomplished by God through Jesus.
Being confident of this very thing, that He which hath BEGUN a good work in you will PERFORM it UNTIL the day of Jesus Christ: (Phillipians 1:6)
There are no Christians more deserving than others. Because you have not yet achieved the state of holiness others have does not mean you are less favored. We all come to the Cross equally lost, and we all came away equally saved.
Salvation is an eternal state for which each of us were chosen before the world began.
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began, Paul writes to Timothy, (2 Timothy 1:9)
“In hope of eternal life, which God, that CANNOT LIE, PROMISED before the world began. . .” (Titus 1:2)
We are eternally secure, because we are eternally saved, which was accomplished in the Mind of God when each of us was called — BEFORE THE WORLD BEGAN!
Let’s bring it together. Nobody can come to Christ unless they are drawn by the Father, who provides us with both the extension of the offer of salvation and the faith necessary to receive it, a calling that was sealed in heaven before the world began, according to His purpose and grace.
Our salvation is immediate and eternal, but our purification is a process, which, having been begun in us at the moment of salvation, will be performed in us — BY CHRIST — until the day we stand before Him. Lest anyone should boast.
That’s not my opinion of what the Bible says — look up the verses in context and see if you can make them mean something else.
“As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.” (Romans 3:10-12)
“For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:” (Romans 3:23-24)
“I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.” (Galatians 2:21)
Legalism runs counter to the clear teaching of Scripture. This is a very difficult doctrine to both teach and understand. It sounds like a license to sin. It is not.
It is an understanding that our relationship to Christ is unique — that God knows our hearts, and has already judged us accordingly. So that sin cannot reign supreme in our mortal body and thereby render us useless to our calling.
If the enemy can convince us of our own personal unrighteousness (of which each of us is acutely aware) or cause us to doubt the truth of Scripture or of our faith (which is a gift from God, lest anyone should boast) or cause us to doubt our own salvation, then we will not be able to effectively wield the Sword of the Spirit, which is the Word of God.
God has a plan for each of us, and His plan is to send us to seek out and introduce others to their Savior. That is our assignment on this earth. THAT is our ‘calling.’ To spread the Gospel.
As Christians, we have an awesome responsibility before God. We have been assigned to seek out the lost and offer them the Gospel. To accomplish our mission, we need to be fully equipped for the task.
That is what eternal security is all about. Not a license to sin, but rather a certain knowledge that our sin is forgiven.
The most effective weapon we have in our war with the enemy is the knowledge that he cannot take away our salvation. There is never a time when we are unworthy to tell others of Jesus Christ.
“But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:” (1st Peter 3:15)
-
Yes, it’s very sound as long as Jesus is your Savior.
-
alot of christians are neither calvinist, nor arminian. God is cool about it
-
Neither Lutheran nor Papist, but Christ and Christ alone died for your sins.
-
Either one or the other … they are just ignorant of the positions … One is either monergist or synergist .. Dont take pride in ignorance
Comments