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Think about it… “To argue that God is ‘trying His…

5 years ago • June 4, 2021 • by ourCOG

Think about it…

“To argue that God is ‘trying His best’ to save all mankind, but that the majority of men will not let Him save them, is to insist that the will of the Creator is impotent, and that the will of the creature is omnipotent.”
– Arthur W. Pink

The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
– 2 Peter 3:9 King James Version (KJV)

“A ‘god’ whose will is resisted, whose designs are frustrated, whose purpose is checkmated, possesses no title to Deity, and so far from being a fit object of worship, merits nought but contempt.”
– Arthur W. Pink

1 When Jesus came down from the mountainside, large crowds followed him. 2 A man with leprosy came and knelt before him and said, “Lord, if you are willing, you can make me clean.”

3 Jesus reached out his hand and touched the man. “I am willing,” he said. “Be clean!” Immediately he was cleansed of his leprosy.
– Matthew 8:1-3 New International Version (NIV)

Something does not add up.

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Discussion

29 comments

  1. Matt Breeding says:
    April 18, 2020 at 1:03 pm

    What doesn’t add up?

    Reply
  2. Matt Breeding says:
    April 18, 2020 at 1:07 pm

    These videos do a good job of explaining some often misunderstood verses and their word usage.

    https://www.monergism.com/john-316-2-peter-39-1-timothy-24-responding-arminian-objections-calvinism-youtube-series

    Reply
  3. Joshua Crosby says:
    April 18, 2020 at 1:08 pm

    It appears that you misunderstand the rationale of the position. Also Pink has made some flawed leaps in logic there.

    God’s sovereignty is not undermined by free will as free will is only possible with a sovereign creator.

    God allowing us to choose to accept his gift is evidence of his desire for a relationship with us.

    Free will does not necessitate the ambiguity of Christ’s sacrifice as is presented in your argument.

    Reply
  4. John Camara says:
    April 18, 2020 at 1:20 pm

    I don’t believe that God wills and desires to save everyone and comes up against obstacles in attempting to do so. It’s more logical to believe that He chooses who will be saved, and others He simply does not choose.

    Paul seems to say that very thing in Romans 9.

    That verse in Peter’s epistle that I quoted is misunderstood.

    Reply
  5. Daniel Marvin says:
    April 18, 2020 at 1:31 pm

    “Free Will Revisited” by Robert Picirilli.

    Reply
  6. Parker Roberts says:
    April 18, 2020 at 2:07 pm

    Revelation 20:7-15 does away with any Christians thought of universalism.

    Reply
  7. K'Mari A. McClean says:
    April 18, 2020 at 4:26 pm

    God gives all the free will to choose to accept or reject him, God in his foresight knew who would accept and reject him. The ones who he knew would accept is what we call the “chosen” of God because it was ordained from the beginning of time. It does not make God any less sovereign by giving people that choice. Instead it shows that merciful, just, and loving character that we see throughout the bible. True love isnt forced. If you dont wanna be with God then the choice to reject him is there. There is enough evidence in the world to have faith in the Bible. If you dont want to then it’s a personal choice that is the gift of free will given to all

    Reply
  8. Alan White says:
    April 18, 2020 at 4:37 pm

    Was it Gods will then that Adam ate the fruit God forbid him to?

    Reply
  9. Alan White says:
    April 18, 2020 at 4:38 pm

    Or did God in his foreknowledge see that Adam would disobey and so had prepared the lamb before the foundation of the world?

    Reply
  10. John Camara says:
    April 18, 2020 at 4:50 pm

    If before creating man God knows that man will sin and proceeds to create man is His intent to create a sinner?

    Does God have the ability to do something different from what He foresaw Himself doing?

    Is He bound to create a sinner, or can He instead create a man that He foresees not sinning?

    Pink had this to say…

    “If then He foresaw that in creating a certain person that that person would despise and reject the saviour, yet knowing this beforehand He, nevertheless, brought that person into existence, then it is clear He designed and ordained that that person should be eternally lost.”
    – A. W. Pink, The Sovereignty of God

    Reply
  11. Jesus Pascal Nnchedonna says:
    April 18, 2020 at 4:51 pm

    Sit down and think how you disobey your father that births and can kill you and yet he believes in you that u will be saved someday.

    Love and Justice is the balance

    Reply
  12. John Camara says:
    April 18, 2020 at 4:54 pm

    One thing is certain. None of us made the choice to exist. Or did we? If we did then we are indeed free agents with the will to determine our existence and future. But if we didn’t then we have no claim to autonomy.

    Are we simply the product of chance and randomness, or were we put into motion by a Prime Mover outside ourselves? A Prime Mover who knew the eventual outcome of our lives before we even existed, and who desired that outcome above any other foreseen possible outcome? For in bringing about our existence was also brought about the outcome of our lives. An outcome which was foreseen as one amongst many other possible outcomes. And yet that one outcome was chosen out of all the others.

    If God knew what we would do before he created us, and had the option of creating someone else who would make different choices, who is ultimately responsible for our choices and actions?

    If I am contemplating creating a human and I can look into the future at their every decision, I am responsible for the decisions that person makes because by bringing that person into existence I also bring that person’s choices into existence.

    Example:

    I can create Mike. I have looked into the future and Mike will be a good person.

    Or,

    I can create Jim. I have looked into the future and Jim will be a murderer.

    In like manner, when God created Lucifer he knew he would become the devil, and when he created Adam he knew he would become a sinner.

    Along the same lines God had the choice of creating Mike whom he foresaw making a choice to love him and as a result go to heaven.

    And he had a choice to create Jim whom he foresaw not loving him and as a result go to hell.

    If he creates Mike who makes the choice that he go to heaven?

    And if he creates Jim who makes the choice that he go to hell?

    There is immediate responsibility, and there is ultimate responsibility.

    It’s up to us to make decisions, but in the ultimate scheme of things those decisions come to be because the Prime Mover brought us into existence knowing that we would make them.

    Reply
  13. Steve Losee says:
    April 18, 2020 at 5:30 pm

    willfully misinterpreting a position is not an effective way to refute it…or to establish your own credibility.

    Reply
  14. Jeremiah Waldrop says:
    April 18, 2020 at 6:51 pm

    This is why apologetics, evangelism, preaching, and prayer will change nothing – all has been predestined by God’s sovereign perfect secret irresistible will. The future is set.

    Reply
  15. Jenny Marie says:
    April 18, 2020 at 6:52 pm

    I like the meme. That’s how I feel about religious people who teach loss of salvation. ?

    Reply
  16. Jenny Marie says:
    April 18, 2020 at 6:55 pm

    But even funnier this is about Calvinism and it is def a horrific doctrine

    Reply
  17. Jeff Finster says:
    April 18, 2020 at 7:54 pm

    Our God is perfect in power. However, this power is accessed by faith in His Son, Yeshua Messiah. He purchased humanity with His own blood. Left all the world with instructions on how to obtain them. But most are not willing because they do not believe. Yet… perhaps they aren’t listening anymore since false teachers abound who peddle their essential theologies rather than obey those promise obtaining instructions our Lord and His Apostles did proclaim. Hmmm…

    Reply
  18. Andrew Beltz says:
    April 18, 2020 at 7:56 pm

    At the prompting of the Holy Spirit, you will recognize Him for who He is, and bow the knee—you are chosen.
    —plain and simple.

    Reply
  19. Carnil Jayawardena says:
    April 18, 2020 at 8:08 pm

    God’s will for adam and eve was for them to obey Him but they didnt. Does that make God impotent? i dont think so, but one thing is clear they loved sin more than God the same as every human being.

    Reply
  20. Matthew Dale Sowers says:
    April 18, 2020 at 8:19 pm

    Why’s the younger guy look like Ryan Reynolds?

    Reply
  21. Kyle Mexsemkillawniin Penney says:
    April 18, 2020 at 9:46 pm

    What do you mean?
    This is cryptic and could sound as though you’re challenging some ideology of a religion. What theology are you supposing?

    Reply
  22. RJ Mueller says:
    April 19, 2020 at 12:34 am

    Your basically saying that God couldn’t have come to save everybody under are free will, since he’s all knowing and we have to ask for forgiveness and fall into repentance. However your misunderstanding the doctrine. When it says everybody will fall to the repentance, it’s saying everybody who’s physically alive at that time period of which it speaks. Obviously someone who’s dead and hasn’t repented, and is likely in hell, can’t come to repentance, it’s to late for that person, but when the doctrine states all will fall to repentance, it’s talking about those that are physically alive on this earth at that time. And also the fact that God knows all, is not an argument against free will, God knowing all does not mean that humans know all, we still have uncertainties about the future of are physical lives, however one thing we can be certain about is if we want to do the right thing and humble areselves before God and accept the forgiveness to remain in his repentance to swear from sinful acts. Jesus death and resurrection, was so that if one day in are lives we develope the sense to realize the wrong were doing, we can at any point in are lives ask for his forgiveness and under God’s grace move away from sin and towards the righteousness of God. So I believe there’s many misconceptions about your views on The purpose of Jesus or the purpose of God’s plan. So hopefully my input has cleared that up abit and may God be with you as you study these curiosities.

    Reply
  23. VaajLeng Yang says:
    April 19, 2020 at 1:26 am
    Reply
  24. VaajLeng Yang says:
    April 19, 2020 at 1:30 am
    Reply
  25. Joanie Appleseed says:
    April 19, 2020 at 3:44 am

    No. He gave us free will.

    Reply
  26. Avi-Asher Hyde says:
    April 19, 2020 at 5:18 am

    If God’s will was always followed John Camara, then every human being would be a believer living just as Yeshua did. That is His will for all humanity. Since that’s not the case and Mr. Pink suggests that God shouldn’t be worshipped in result, we must conclude that Pink is complete dunce.

    Reply
  27. Robert Finney says:
    April 19, 2020 at 6:44 pm

    Pink’s inability to figure out who’s talking to who, when, and under what circumstances, is what doesn’t add up.

    Reply
  28. Daniel Sidderley says:
    April 20, 2020 at 2:32 pm

    Pink couldn’t discern his way out of a supermarket, never mind navigate his way through the Bible.

    Reply
  29. Juan M. Chavez says:
    April 21, 2020 at 12:01 pm

    Its called free will. My Bro. If God had created a humanity that did not need Salvation we would be Angels or Robots. He wants humanity to love him and be saved out of there free will not because he (God) cant save everyone of course he can. 2 Peter 3:9 Says he does not want anyone to perish. Meaning he wants everyone to be saved out of there free will and Love for him.

    Reply

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